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Pipelines and business process modelling

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Henrik Pettersen

Pipelines and business process modelling

All,

looking at the XML Processing Model document at w3c, and from my own
experiences with xpl, there seems to be some overlap with business
process modelling, such as BPEL
(http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_cat.php?cat=ws):
- The document centricity
- Seperation of process logic (parallel processing, conditional
branching, etc.) from document transformations (the pipeline
components, e.g. an XSLT transformation)
- The service integration points (webservices, java, pipeline components)
- etc.

How do you see the upcoming XML Processing Model fitting into this?

Thanks!

Henrik

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Stephen Bayliss

RE: Pipelines and business process modelling

I agree, there certainly is overlap, and in terms of the future
direction of OPS (and BPEL for that matter) I think it's important to
recognise the strengths and weaknesses of both, and combine technologies
appropriately.

I see this as (at a very basic level, and this is in terms of OPS's XML
pipeline processing, not the web front end; ie Xforms + Ajax can be seen
as a separate software component in the application stack):

OPS:
- Good at processing XML documents at the detail level
- Reasonable at web service integration (both providing and consuming
SOAP services could be significantly enhanced)
- Bad at fault tolerance, handling error conditions, no equivalence of
BPEL compensation, dealing with long-running transactions

BPEL:
- Good for fault tolerance, handling error conditions, compensation,
dealing with long-running transactions
- Good at web service integration
- Bad at processing XML documents at the detail level

I see them as complementary technologies, ideally macro-level processes
being handled by BPEL, which delegates to OPS for micro-level
processing.

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Henrik Pettersen [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 30 August 2006 11:18
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [ops-users] Pipelines and business process modelling

All,

looking at the XML Processing Model document at w3c, and from my own
experiences with xpl, there seems to be some overlap with business
process modelling, such as BPEL
(http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_cat.php?cat=ws):
- The document centricity
- Seperation of process logic (parallel processing, conditional
branching, etc.) from document transformations (the pipeline
components, e.g. an XSLT transformation)
- The service integration points (webservices, java, pipeline
components)
- etc.

How do you see the upcoming XML Processing Model fitting into this?

Thanks!

Henrik

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Erik Bruchez

Re: Pipelines and business process modelling

Administrator

Stephen,

I couldn't have said it better :-)

We thought back in 2003 that we would move away from XPL to go to BPEL
(because BPEL is a standard and XPL is not), but now we have definitely
changed our mind. The XML pipeline language we are developing at W3C
(and which will be close from XPL) works at a much finer granularity
than business process languages and does not come with all the weight of
WSDL and web services.

If you want to write a pipeline to transform a document though a couple
of XSLT stylesheets, you are very unlikely to use BPEL. The same goes
for all the use cases we have gathered here:

http://www.w3.org/TR/xproc-requirements/

Also, BPEL was designed for tools. It is heavy to write anything by hand
and we hope that the W3C pipeline language will have a lighter syntax,
comparable to XPL.

So there is complementarity between the approaches and using an XML
pipeline language does not preclude at all integration with BPEL.

-Erik

Stephen Bayliss wrote:

> I agree, there certainly is overlap, and in terms of the future
> direction of OPS (and BPEL for that matter) I think it's important to
> recognise the strengths and weaknesses of both, and combine technologies
> appropriately.
>
> I see this as (at a very basic level, and this is in terms of OPS's XML
> pipeline processing, not the web front end; ie Xforms + Ajax can be seen
> as a separate software component in the application stack):
>
> OPS:
> - Good at processing XML documents at the detail level
> - Reasonable at web service integration (both providing and consuming
> SOAP services could be significantly enhanced)
> - Bad at fault tolerance, handling error conditions, no equivalence of
> BPEL compensation, dealing with long-running transactions
>
> BPEL:
> - Good for fault tolerance, handling error conditions, compensation,
> dealing with long-running transactions
> - Good at web service integration
> - Bad at processing XML documents at the detail level
>
> I see them as complementary technologies, ideally macro-level processes
> being handled by BPEL, which delegates to OPS for micro-level
> processing.
>
> Steve
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Henrik Pettersen [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: 30 August 2006 11:18
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [ops-users] Pipelines and business process modelling
>
> All,
>
> looking at the XML Processing Model document at w3c, and from my own
> experiences with xpl, there seems to be some overlap with business
> process modelling, such as BPEL
> (http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_cat.php?cat=ws):
> - The document centricity
> - Seperation of process logic (parallel processing, conditional
> branching, etc.) from document transformations (the pipeline
> components, e.g. an XSLT transformation)
> - The service integration points (webservices, java, pipeline
> components)
> - etc.
>
> How do you see the upcoming XML Processing Model fitting into this?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Henrik
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
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> To unsubscribe: mailto:[hidden email]
> For general help: mailto:[hidden email]?subject=help
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